Thursday, January 29, 2015

Save the idots from the bullets

Two very foolish Australian lads are on death row in Indonesia. They were convicted of importing drugs into the country. Haha, as R would say, that is like taking coal to Newcastle, that is Newcastle upon Tyne or Newcastle upon Hunter. Correction: They were taking drugs from Indonesia to bring back to Australia.

Most countries don't like people importing drugs and have varying penalties if the carriers are caught. But in this case, the punishment seems to exceed the crime. The pair, Andrew Chan and Myuran Sukumaran, killed no one, raped no one, did not abuse a child or torture a kitten. It could be argued that they might be indirectly responsible for deaths from drugs, but you can hardly be found guilty of a crime of the future that has not been committed. Never mind, it seems their end in nigh and Indonesia will shoot them dead.

The intrigues of government diplomacy are no doubt working overtime and it would be very interesting to know, but we won't. 

It probably matters little to the new president of Indonesia, Joko Widodo, but I think I will go to my grave thinking badly of Indonesia if the country kills these two lads, who were stupid and no doubt saw an adventurous way to make a quick buck. What is a faithful Moslem in Indonesia who molests a child sentenced to, I wonder.



28 comments:

  1. We will never know the answer to your query.
    I expect those two went to that country knowing what would happen if they got caught. Killing them, I don't agree with as it seems way too harsh. On the other hand, how many would they have killed trying to import drugs!

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    1. WA, of course they would have known. They are idiots, no doubt. Yes, people could die from their actions and they deserve punishment, but not death.

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  2. Indonesia. I decline that. I have always declined that, and I always will. :)



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  3. I thought they were caught bringing drugs back into Australia ? It is the worst penalty to pay for sure so you would want to think pretty carefully about doing it in the first place !

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    1. Grace, pretty sure they were taking them in. It seems as a deterrent, the threat of execution does not work very well.

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    2. Andrew, it was Schapelle who got busted taking drugs into Bali; this bunch were definitely bringing stuff back to Oz. Their arrest by the Indonesians was almost certainly as the result of a tipoff by the AFP, which is the most shameful part of it, as the AFP always knew of the risk of the death penalty - they could surely have waited until the suspects were back here and arrested them coming off the plane,

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    3. Marcellous, as I was typing that, I started to have doubts and I should have checked. Thanks. Yes, I remember the details now and what was a very odd action by the AFP with terrible consequences.

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  4. Andrew, importing drugs is forbidden in European Union... In my opinion it is a wise decision..

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    1. Forbidden it may be Gosia, but I personally know drugs flow back and forth between Amsterdam and England on the ferries.

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  5. Most, if not all, of those convicted in connection with the Bali bombings in which hundreds were killed have completed prison sentences and been released.

    From media reports - not always reliable but in this case consistently made - these two are reformed individuals doing good works in prison.

    I'm against death penalties.

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    1. Victor, an excellent point about the Bali bombers. They do seem to be doing good works, but is that to help their situation or genuine. Perhaps a bit of both.

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  6. My thoughts on this crime are not quite as liberal as yours Andrew but this particular case has me stumped. Too many 'how do we knows '.

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    1. Cathy, I would not say I was particularly liberal about importing drugs, but I don't think it should be an automatic death sentence for the ring leaders, especially compared to the lesser penalties for what in my opinion are far worse crimes.

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  7. I am against the death penalty. Firmly against it. It allows for now reformation, has been responsible for innocents dying and my nasty self believes that for some crimes it is too easy. A life imprisoned is a nastier and more lingering punishment.
    Interestingly I saw a documentary once about an American State with the death penalty. The cause of death listed on the death certificate for those executed? Homicide.

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    1. EC, I so agree with you about punishment. Let them suffer a long lingering time in prison until they die. That is interesting about the death certificate. I wonder if down the track the question could be asked in a court, who committed this homicide?

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    2. Agreed totally Elephant's Child.

      What is the difference between a bank robber who murders some bank tellers, and a hangman commissioned by the courts to murder a criminal. Oh yes, there IS a difference. The bank robber may have not intended to murder the tellers; the state's hangman is being asked to commit a planned, cold hearted murder.

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    3. Hels, for me it is simple. No one has the right to take another's life, except perhaps in self defence, which might include war.

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    4. I guess I'd rather if I were destined for life in an Indonesia prison, be shot. Preferable to life in hell. But as for dealing drugs or importing drugs compared to other crimes of all kinds, I too wonder about death for drugs. Is there something not stated, that they have done, I wonder. the young take such risks, flaunt death and then cry loudly for pity when they are snarled in its grasp.

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    5. Strayer, prison in Indonesia is somewhat more relaxed than western style prisons, with some contact with the outside world. The more money you have, the more comfortable you will be. I doubt there is anything else behind this. Other countries have had their citizens executed there.

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    6. In this morning's Age, there was an article called "How Ronald Ryan's hanging changed me forever".

      If a criminal is executed, it diminishes his life of course and his family's, but it also diminishes every member of the community. I will never ever ever forget Ronald Ryan's execution, even though it was back in 1967. I thought Australia had crawled back into the barbaric stone age.

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    7. Hels, I am just a bit too young to remember the hanging in detail. Ryan did not die in vain. His hanging led Victoria to abolish death by the State. I'll have a look for the piece from this morning's paper. It was Bolte in power then wasn't it?

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  8. Vulnerable young people who make stupid life decisions. Such a shame :(

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    1. Fen, I guess these two were the organisers and so get the worse punishment. But it does seem very harsh for a youthful but serious crime.

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  9. first; the death penalty for importing drugs is well known and has been for years, so these two were very foolish to try it.
    second; they were just the unlucky ones who got caught, I'm sure there are many who get drugs into that country without getting caught.
    third; the drugs flow back the other way quite easily too, people bringing them back to Australia, where they are caught by our sniffer dogs.
    fourth; death does seem a little harsh, but, but, okay, killing them is wrong, but they knew the consequences before they tried it, and did it anyway. Life imprisonment seems fairer , but is it really?

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    1. River, some drugs are caught by our sniffer dogs and xray machines, but I think most get through ok. While I never did anything like they did when I was young, I may have walked on the wild side a bit and got away with it.

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  10. I think that it is really "overdo it" must have political reasons, it looks nice to arrest foreigners, there are probably too many Indonesian drug dealers to arrest them all !

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    1. Gattina, I am surprised that you have such a clear understanding of the situation. You have summed it up precisely.

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